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Discussion Starter #241
More on E-torx sockets

I replaced the timing belt on my 2013 Chevy Cruze yesterday, and found I could use some more E-torx sockets. The set I got a while back is not bad, but I wish there was some overlap between the various drive sizes.

There were some recessed E10 screws on the timing belt cover where the ⅜" drive E10 socket, with its wider base, was almost too big and cumbersome to fit. Having a ¼" drive E10 would have been handy.

With standard socket sets, for example, you will usually get a ¼" drive 10mm _and_ a ⅜" drive 10mm. But this E-torx set lacks that overlap. I can see having a couple more pieces in the set being very useful. A ⅜" drive E18 comes to mind.

I'll probably add a ¼" drive E10 to the mix when I get a chance.

The other thing I anticipate is needing to get some impact e-torx sockets. I can see that on the horizon, too :)

Doug

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I picked up a Black 26x22 US General deep top chest and rolling cabinet on sale for around $500 at Harbor Freight just before Labor Day Weekend.
These are much heavier and deeper units than my older 1980's craftsman rollaway toolboxes and they have nicer slides. As heavy as the Snap On cabinets I've seen. It took two people to load and un-load em.

I'm getting a Grizzly G4003 lathe in the next month or so and I'm going to put it on one of the Husky 66" cabinets or a similar US General cabinet with lots of drawers rather than pay the same for a flimsy metal lathe cabinet from Grizzly with almost no tooling storage.

I've been looking at clapped out overpriced old Iron for the last 15 years that I'll be fighting with for years to make just OK. My Monarch Model A was cheap but it's over 110 years old and it's been well loved. I've spent a lot of time fixin the lathe rather than making parts. The drip lube sleeve bearing spindle speeds are more in line with cutting tooling from that time too. When I kick up the spindle speed the headstock bearings get hot.
It's time to have a decent lathe and I'm getting one that's not a project in and of itself. I want to make parts... not fix a "vintage antique lathe". Screw antique. I want to make round things without paying most of the new lathe price and still fighting with an old beat to death machine to do it.

The G4003 has a good old fashioned Norton Gearbox so I don't have to play with the change gears other than for Metric threads. It weighs in at well over 1,000 lbs so it has enough mass to make decent cuts. It has power crosslide, a 36mm spindle hole so it'll take a 5C collet drawtube, and it has a D1-4 camlock spindle rather than the threaded spindles you find on most old US lathes in this size and price range. It has the follow and steady rest that goes with the machine so I don't have to go on a scavenger hunt for overpriced clapped out parts. The three and four jaw chucks might not be the best but I have my Buck and Skinner chucks from my old beat up Monarch model A. I have a buyer for the Monarch that "loves the Antique machine"... The only tooling he's getting is the 12Jarno 5C adapter and dead centre, Armstrong toolpost, and a 10" dog drive faceplate. I'll give him the threaded chuck adapters as well but I'm keeping that 8" Buck 3 jaw and the 10" Skinner 4jaw I brought back from the dead. I hope he doesn't hate me in 6 months... I did point out all the parts that I know need attention and I said I'm not fixin them so I'm not "that guy".
 

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Here's another pic I stole from Facebook that was poking a little fun at Snap-On :)

Doug

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But hey, the snap on man is sure to give you one of those nice calendars to go along with your purchase.;) lol Or do they still have those?
 

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Not seeing anything past hatzie's post#240 2 weeks ago???
Had the same problem earlier, could not even see the reply I had just made. I was trying to view from the active topics tab, would not load page 17. Just tried from the off topic discussions room and what do you know page 17 and my earlier post showed up.

Forum gremlins strike again????
 

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And Suddenly it's working again. Wonder what's going on...
 

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I replaced the timing belt on my 2013 Chevy Cruze yesterday, and found I could use some more E-torx sockets. The set I got a while back is not bad, but I wish there was some overlap between the various drive sizes.

There were some recessed E10 screws on the timing belt cover where the ⅜" drive E10 socket, with its wider base, was almost too big and cumbersome to fit. Having a ¼" drive E10 would have been handy.

With standard socket sets, for example, you will usually get a ¼" drive 10mm _and_ a ⅜" drive 10mm. But this E-torx set lacks that overlap. I can see having a couple more pieces in the set being very useful. A ⅜" drive E18 comes to mind.

I'll probably add a ¼" drive E10 to the mix when I get a chance.

The other thing I anticipate is needing to get some impact e-torx sockets. I can see that on the horizon, too :)

Doug

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I was finally able to see your post.
I had to get a set for GM seat hold-down bolts and nuts in my 2005 Silverado 3/4 ton.

Are they using these abominations under the vehicles now?
 

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Discussion Starter #251
I was finally able to see your post.
I had to get a set for GM seat hold-down bolts and nuts in my 2005 Silverado 3/4 ton.

Are they using these abominations under the vehicles now?
Well, under the hood, for sure! The fasteners on the timing chain cover and crank pulley were reverse torx.

The mounting bolts for the timing belt tensioner and timing belt idler were regular torx.

The passenger end motor mount bolts were all traditional hex. And the negative battery terminal was still a 10mm hex :)

The only other socket I used was like a 17mm 12-pt that fit on this odd-duck looking bolt head for relieving the tension in the service belt.

Doug

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Discussion Starter #253 (Edited)
^ Doug, which eng. is in your '13 Cruze? Are they all timing belt vs chain?
Hi, Sheila,

On the gen1 North American Cruzes, 2011-2016, they had 3 basic engine options. The 1.8 normally aspirated DOHC motors all had timing belts. As I understand it, the 1.4 liter DOHC turbo motors all had chains. Not sure about the diesels. For the current generation, 2016-2019, I think the new 1.4's also have chains.
...
My 1.8 was pretty much the low-tech option on the Cruze, but I'm very pleased with them - we have two. They are still light years ahead of the crappy 4-bangers we had when I began driving back in the 70's. And even better, they seem to have substantially fewer problems than the turbo and diesel options :)

That said, the LFX-6T70 combo in the recent Impalas is appreciably more durable (IMO). I've dealt with multiple cooling system issues on the Cruzes. Fortunately, I've stayed ahead of all of them, but all it takes is one leak to pop up and ruin a motor with an unknowing kid driving.

Doug

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Discussion Starter #255 (Edited)
^+1. What is the recommended mileage for a timing belt change and is it a difficult task?
97,500 miles. Joes74challenger and I were discussing that recently. It's kind of an odd number, but I suppose there's some statistical failure rate number associated with that. Otherwise, surely they would have rounded it to 100k miles. For sure, I did :)

It's not too bad a task, but it helps to be agile. There were several times I needed to get underneath, then get back topside, and I'm nursing a bad shoulder right now. You quickly realize the added challenge of standing up without being able to rely on your left arm :)

I now have much more respect for folks living with physical challenges !

I used a timing belt kit that comes with the required new tensioner, tensioner mounting bolt, and idler. But it lacks the required new idler bolt and new crank pulley bolt. Go figure. I picked those 2 up at the dealer.

The trick to getting it over the tensioner was realizing the tensioner had 2 springs in it. You can rotate it ~30° and it feels like you hit a stop. And the belt won't slip over. I tried several tricks to get it to slip over, and employed my wife and daughter to help, but nothing I tried provided enough slack in the belt to get it on the tensioner.

Finally, in frustration, I over-torqued the tensioner only to find another ~30° of rotation, which then allowed the belt to slide on easily. What I was hitting - what I thought was the stop - was actually the 2nd spring engaging inside the tensioner. I wish that had been noted, preferably in bold lettering, somewhere in the instructions!

The other tricky part was installing the cam locking tool. It is two pieces which must be slid in between the two can gears. Again, extra hands are needed. Someone has to be slightly rocking the crank while the other is up top holding the two pieces against the two gears while trying to line them up with each other. You gotta hold your tongue just right :)

Book time on this is about 2 hours. I probably have 6 times that :) I was taking my time, taking lots of pics, reading and re-reading the manuals, and making sure I was following the Mechanocratic oath: "First, don't break anything."

But with a couple more go-rounds, I could maybe get it down to 2 hours :)

Doug

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When I was a kid we called things like that complex cam sprocket lock mystery tools...

How much does SPX or OTC or whomever is making GM special tools now get for that cam gear lock doohicky?

I remember using a small Inverted torx on Optispark modules... E3 IIRC. That and the headlamp aiming screws on my T800 Silverado are the only E Torx I've run into in the engine bays.
Hex heads resist rust degridation better than bolts with tiny points on them.
So far I've avoided buying vehicles made in the second decade of this century. Eventually I'll have to buy one and jump on the Diag tool merry-go-round again.
 

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Discussion Starter #257 (Edited)
When I was a kid we called things like that complex cam sprocket lock mystery tools...

How much does SPX or OTC or whomever is making GM special tools now get for that cam gear lock doohicky?
Kent Moore. And they make Snap-On look very affordable! The prices shown below tend to be high-balls I culled from Google; the actual KM tools can be had for less, but are still expensive.


KM-6340 cam locking tool
$331.24

KM-6625 flywheel/crank locking tool
$83.35

KM-6349 drive belt tensioner locking tool <-- didn't use
$19.99

KM-6333 timing belt tensioner locking tool <-- didn't use
$65.75

KM-45059 angle meter <-- used mechanical version instead
$728.32​


Conversely, going no-name on eBay, I got the top four items in the list in a kit for 22 bucks shipped :) And it includes two extra tools. Those would probably be another $500 at KM :)

In lieu of the electronic angle meter, I bought a 15 dollar mechanical unit at Autozone. It's not as easy to use, but I can afford it :)

I didn't use either of the locking pins - neither of the tensioners really needed to be locked. (But next time I'm working on the front of my 97 F-150 motor, I will go looking for a way to lock it - that would be handy. Knowing that some tensioners can be locked is a useful lesson from this project.) Regarding the tensioner locking pin, it's interesting to note that they're asking $66 for something not much different than a large paper clip unfolded :)

I will say, the angle meter is kind of tricky to use, and I probably didn't get very close on the numbers. IIRC, the procedure is to tighten the tensioner mounting bolt to 15 ft-lbs, then turn it another 120°, then turn it another 15°. My 120 was probably ±30 :) And it might have taken two pulls to get there rather than one continuous crank.

The 15° turn was probably within ±10° of spec, I hope.

Using the mechanical angle gauge requires some practice, and, despite me working at it, I still struggled with it. Also, there's not always a place for the hook on the back to rest against. The hook is supposed to hold the dial face steady while you rotate the wrench and corresponding needle on the face of the dial.

Anyway, this torque-to-yield stuff is out of my area of expertise, and I try to respect the engineering behind it, but my internal BS detector keeps me wondering how critical those angles are :)

Nevertheless, I try to go by the book. A lot less stuff gets broken that way :)

Overall, I have less than 40 bucks in these tools. Add another 25 for the reverse torx sockets used.

Never start a project unless you can get some new tools out of it :)

Doug

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Discussion Starter #258
When your nose itches...

...and your hands are dirty...

My buddy just posted this to Facebook. But my reply was quick on the draw.

In a situation like this, I just take off my gloves and scratch my nose :) Then glove back up.

These latex gloves, with textured finger tips, are usually in stock at Autozone. You can save a few bucks at Home Depot, but for that I had to wait a couple days for stock to arrive (via branch transfer).

HTH.

(I thought I had already made a post about gloves, but nothing came up in search. Hope this isn't a repeat.)

Doug

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Discussion Starter #259 (Edited)
Necessity is the mother of redneck inventions...

There are times when I need a small tipped vacuum cleaner attachment. So I finally made my own.

This one uses a 2.5"-to-1.25" vacuum hose adapter, available at Home Depot and many other places. The small hose is about 7/16" outside diameter and was obtained at Autozone where they cut it off a bulk roll. The end was wrapped with many turns of 1" wide masking tape to fit it inside the 1.25" opening, then sealed with several more wraps.

It's hard to see in the pic, but a piece of stainless, salvaged from a spent windshield wiper blade, was used as a stiffener that helps guide the business end into position.

It comes in handy under the hood of the car. Cleaning out plug wells before removing the plugs is a good example of that.

HTH.

Doug

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Discussion Starter #260
In search of more reverse torx sockets

Following up on this, I looked for an E10 socket with ¼" drive, and was surprised at how scarce they are. I found two. And had to go to some fringe players, Snap-On and Grainger :)

Seriously, I checked Lowe's/Craftsman, Home Depot and Northern Tool, as well as Googling it. Snap On had it, and kudos for them :) But I didn't even bother to price it. Finally, I found one at Grainger, where I've bought a few tools before. They carry broad selections of Proto, S-K and Westward sockets. Needless to say, Proto and S-K are expensive. For an E10-¼" drive, only S-K and Westward had that size. S-K was about 10x the price :) And only had a deep version.

Researching it some more (on Google), I found a deep one in a 6-pc set ($10) at Harbor Freight (Pittsburgh® brand). I also found a Zoro brand one at zoro.com for $7 plus shipping. For 10 bucks, I might add the Harbor Freight set to my collection, but I'm not sure I see much need for deep reverse torx sockets unless we start seeing torx nuts, right? (Deep sockets are primarily for nuts, right?)

I've never purchased from Zoro, so I can't comment on how they are to trade with, but I have made several purchases from Grainger, usually other inexpensive, small sockets, and am very pleased. I order on-line, then go pick up the parts at their Plano store here. Some times I have to wait a day or two for it to arrive at the branch, but there's no shipping charges for that. All I pay is local taxes. They email me when it arrives. (I could probably get a text, too, but I'm still a bit of a dinosaur in that regard :) )

Anyway, I got the Westward, with tax, for $2.10. It's not a high end brand, but at this price, I'll take my chances :) Seriously, repeating myself, I don't know if there are any truly cheap tools anymore. Plus, when you consider the applications of an E10 - we're talking 4-6mm diameter screws - so I don't see the tool being exposed to lots of high stress use.

As you can see in the pic, it has a much narrower base than the ⅜" drive E10 next to it. So the new one will fit in tight places with a little more room to spare.

All I need now is to find a matching clip for the socket rail. I actually think I have one, but I need to do some digging thru my stash :)

Doug

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